Phoenix punk band Man Hands performed a Tiny Desert Concert in the studio.
It’s fronted by Mark Berry and Jackie Cruz. Jackie also runs Vagfest — a local festival celebrating women in music.
Full conversation
JACKIE CRUZ: I think that we have a really cool punk scene here. A lot of stuff's going on. I think a lot of bands are doing older style music, which I like a lot of like ‘60s-type stuff, psychedelic and punk and like meshing everything together and creating new sounds and styles. So I like that a lot.
I think other cities have a lot more going on, but they're bigger, like Austin or San Francisco have like bigger music scenes, but I think what we have going on here is really cool, and we've made friends with a lot of the bands we play with too, so we're like a tight-knit music community.
STEVE GOLDSTEIN: What about the Phoenix scene as far as women are concerned? Is there a feeling that a female musician has more challenges in this area, but also with the kind of music you're playing?
CRUZ: I'm not necessarily sure with the kind of music. I mean, I noticed that a lot of women are maybe known for doing poppy, kind of indie rock, and so maybe there's not as many women doing like aggressive punk, but I feel like there are more challenges for women.
Sometimes we get treated differently, playing shows, performing, you know, by sound people or promoters or things like that, but I feel like from the years I've been playing, I've been playing in bands in Phoenix for about 10 years. I've gotten to know a lot of the people in the community, so they just treat me as an equal and all the guys that I play with and all the bands we play with when I'm playing with them, I'm not treated any differently.
And I think in the punk scene, too, in other cities, everyone's very aware of that and how women have been mistreated in these kind of situations. So I think people are becoming more aware. I don't deal with it as much as I guess as I used to when I was younger, but I mean it still happens and it's frustrating.
GOLDSTEIN: Well, so how important is something like Vagfest to encourage other women and other female musicians to get involved and feel confident about what they're doing?
CRUZ: I hope it's an important thing to women. I reach out to a lot of the ladies when I hear their music. I want them to be involved because I like to create like camaraderie and have other women to share music experiences with and to make friends with, and it's a fun thing and plus I just like hanging out with girls and jamming and listening to music that women make cause it's it's cool to me.
GOLDSTEIN: OK guys, so why don't you play a song for us? What's up first?
MARK BERRY: Absolutely. This song is called “Looking for Omens.”
[Song performance]
GOLDSTEIN: Let's talk a little about the venues that the two of you play because it's a wide variety. Do you have a preference based on whether it's a DIY or whether it's a place like a 21 and over club where something like that? Does it affect how you play? Does it affect how the audience reacts to you?
BERRY: I'd say the more comfortable we are definitely we get a better response because we perform a lot better, but to me, it doesn't really matter. I really care about like the ambiance and if it some places just don't feel comfortable.
CRUZ: I would say I like kind of more intimate smaller spaces or like darker dive-y type bars or clubs. If the stage is too big, it can be intimidating.
BERRY: You go into a place and you don't feel like everyone's an ice queen or like you feel warmth there and friendliness and maybe a little darker. We don't care for the well lit places. I don't know, it's like some feeling in the air.
GOLDSTEIN: How much of it has to do with feeding off your fellow band members? Jackie, what about that?
CRUZ: I don't know. I think it depends because maybe if I know that he's a little nervous and anxious, I can get a little more nervous and anxious or you know if we're not getting along before a show, that could actually make us have a really good performance because when we're angry at each other on stage, I think that helps sometimes.
BERRY: I play, our best shows have been when we were pissed.
CRUZ: We're both kind of neurotic.
BERRY: We’re not natural performers, but we love it.
CRUZ: Yeah, we both get really nervous and I get sick before we play. Sometimes I have to run in the bathroom like we both are just like, oh, and then we go up stage and then we're fine. I just, yeah, this is the truth.
GOLDSTEIN: It's interesting hearing how both of you feel about the actual being neurotic and still really, really wanting to do this.
So I wonder from a creative standpoint, is it important that thousands and thousands of people get your album, download it, hear it, whatnot, or do you take satisfaction from the fact that that is a band you've come together as a group that's really in sync?
BERRY: I think you have to take pleasure in those small accomplishments because I don't feel like the music industry is, it seems very hard.
CRUZ: I know, especially for our style of music, we're not going to reach like hundreds and thousands and millions of people with this style of music. It'll never be mainstream, but it would be cool to be able to play like bigger venues and just like the mini goals that we have for ourselves and playing music.
BERRY: I know when I look back on like the goals we set out when we first started this, we've done so many of them. It feels really good. This has been the most fulfilling experience of my life being in this band.
GOLDSTEIN: All right guys, take us out on one more song here.
CRUZ: OK, this one is called “New Life.”
If you’re in a band or know of one you’d like to hear on air, send us a note at [email protected].
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