A judge earlier this year ruled Arizona’s law banning abortions after 15 weeks is unconstitutional; that followed the passage in November of Proposition 139, which enshrined abortion rights into the Arizona Constitution.
Despite that, some Republican state lawmakers are pushing measures that critics say would still restrict the procedure. One would prohibit the state from giving money to any entity that performs or promotes abortions. And Dr. Jill Gibson says actions coming from Washington, D.C., also give her pause.
Gibson, an obstetrician/gynecologist and abortion provider with Camelback Family Planning in Phoenix, joined The Show to discuss the issue, starting with describing the state of reproductive care in Arizona right now.
Full conversation
DR. JILL GIBSON: Yeah, I would still characterize the state of reproductive health in Arizona as a really mixed bag. Of course, we were hugely celebratory after we had the passage of our ballot initiative, and particularly once the election was certified and our Attorney General really hastily made known that, of course, the 15 week ban was unconstitutional. We were able to offer expanded access of abortion to our patients and our community. But I think we also would be remiss to not feel cautious and not feel nervous and feel some trepidation about what the future holds with a with the new administration that has come in, they've made it very clear that one of their top priorities is to really limit access, particularly to abortion, but also to all aspects of sexual reproductive health care, including contraception and gender affirming hormone therapy and care. And so I think we're really feeling, on the one hand, happy about the things that we've been able to achieve in this state, but we're also feeling nervous about what the future might hold with this new administration.
MARK BRODIE: What makes you the most nervous about what the near future might hold?
GIBSON: I think I'm feeling very concerned about what I feel is a very dangerous action that this administration has taken, which is to really undermine basic science and basic factual information. So we as physicians and healthcare providers rely on research and literature and projects and studies that have been done and rigorously tested, and we have evidence based medicine because of these really rigorous studies, and to have an administration come in and try and undermine that process and see that things that are based on non science or junk science, or science that has been proven false are actual treatments or actual valid options for treatments. It's just, it's really disturbing as a physician and as a scientist.
BRODIE: Are there particular areas where that has been the case so far that you've observed?
GIBSON: Yeah, I can give you one really good example for my field, in particular, the CDC puts out every couple of years something called the MEC, which is the MediCal eligibility criteria. This helps clinicians determine what methods of contraception are safe for patients. So it basically goes through and looks at all sorts of health conditions and then stratifies each method of contraception and its safety profile for a patient with that certain disease profile or condition. This has been the Bible for anyone who is providing contraceptive care, because it's so thorough and so well evidenced and really researched very well. And almost immediately after the Trump administration took office, this was removed from the CDC website, in addition the STI guidelines that for treatment for sexually transmissible infections that the CDC puts out, that was also removed, in addition to a couple of other really important documents that that we have relied on for decades because of the trusted information that the CDC provides.
BRODIE: Were you able, or was somebody able to download those or screenshot it before that data went away?
GIBSON: Yeah, we were. We had a heads up that this was going to be happening. And so there were multiple, you know, bodies, ACOG, for example, and others, who quickly went into action and made copies and downloads and encouraged people who are regularly using these to download these documents. But I think it's just the idea that someone that our government is trying to censor this reliable health information from the clinicians that need to have it to accurately take care of patients is just, you know, disturbing beyond this precedent is something that I think is going to be extremely harmful.
BRODIE: What are you seeing in terms of what patients are telling you, and maybe what kinds of appointments they're trying to make and what kind of information they're looking for at your place of employ?
GIBSON: Patients are definitely feeling anxious about access to contraception. We, especially here in Arizona, have seen what happens when the government interferes with reproductive rights. We saw this after the Dobbs decision, when we for periods of time, extended periods of time, lost the ability to provide abortion care in the state. And so Arizonans, I think, uniquely recognize what can happen when the government is trying to make clinical decisions for them and for their communities. And, you know, the Trump administration has not been secretive about its desire to reclassify contraceptiveness, something that's dangerous or something that is shouldn't be, you know, covered by insurance, etc, and patients feel very anxious about that, because they have, you know, relied on contraceptive for decades, for, you know, 7080, years we've had access to contraceptive, and patients are really worried because they know how important it is for them to be able to access that, to control their lives. And so we see patients coming in and asking for the longest acting. Contraceptive methods that are available, we patients are more interested in vasectomy. I've had patients asking, you know, how many packs of birth control pills can I buy at one time? And we're seeing that same trend happen in our gender affirming care population. They're, you know, wanting to stockpile medications because they feel that there is a very real threat that those medications will not be available to them in the future.
BRODIE: How much does what happens in other states affect what happens here? I mean, obviously, you know, different states have different laws and regulations regarding abortion, both the procedures performed in person and medication abortions. I'm curious how you know what happens, not just sort of in our neighboring states, but other states around the country. Does that have an impact here?
GIBSON: It certainly does. It's been extremely chilling to see the impact of the removal of the right to access abortion across basically the entire southern part of the United States, including, you know, Florida and Texas, and we are seeing just many, many patients coming from those states. The lucky ones that are able to travel have the means to travel, the resources to travel, but we are seeing many patients from Texas and from Florida who are coming to Arizona to get their abortion services. And it's a strain on the system as well, right? We know that Arizona is just now building back from having real disruption in our ability to provide abortion for the past, you know, two and a half years, we've been trying to rebuild our infrastructure after it was really pulled out underneath us in 2022 and so for Arizona to have to now be in an access state, you know, a receiving state, we certainly own that responsibility, and we want more than anything, to help all the patients that we can. But it is, you know, certainly going to impact our ability to wait times, for example, to help the patients in our own community.
