President Donald Trump has authorized a 90-day pause in the tariffs that went into effect this week, although that does not include those on China.
Stock markets had reacted negatively to the news of the generally across-the-board tariffs announced last week. They rebounded on the news of the pause, though they’re down again so far Thursday. While many economists and elected leaders worried about how the tariffs would impact consumer prices and the economy more broadly, our next guest was not one of them.
Jose Grijalva, mayor of Douglas, a town on the Arizona-Mexico border in the southeastern part of the state, joined The Show to discuss, after the tariffs had been announced, but before the pause, what he’s seeing in his town as it relates to this latest round of tariffs.
Full conversation
JOSE GRIJALVA: We're actually not seeing a lot of panic here. We're in a 2-mile radius with Mexico and Agua Prieto Sonora, which is our sister city. We have an agreement with them to, you know, we, we help each other out. So I mean, once they cross the border here they can go right to Walmart and then we could go right into their, into their, you know, their stores and, and their, doctors too.
So, no, we, there's not much of a problem because with the tariffs, you know, if we want Mexican products, all we have to do is cross the border. We just buy tortillas and, and cheese and then come back. So it's not really going to affect us like it is, you know, the northern cities, you know, farther up.
MARK BRODIE: So you and your residents are able to basically avoid any tariffs on goods coming into the U.S. by getting them before they come into the U.S.
GRIJALVA: Yeah.
BRODIE: And is this something that is reasonably easy to do in Douglas?
GRIJALVA: Oh yeah, I mean, even, you know, just to give you an example on, and it's easy on both sides if you think, if you kind of think about it. When we had COVID and, and they had to shut down the border, we thought that we're gonna lose the Mexican sales tax, you know, the people who come in and buy, there's 70% of our sales tax is Mexico, so.
They would have one person, you know, cross and take a shopping list and take it back, and that's kind of what we do on the other side too, you know, somebody needs tortillas or, or, or cheese or, you know, the Mexican products, even like the Mexican sodas and the glass bottles, though, you know, if they can cross they'll cross, but if not, then they can find somebody else to cross it for them. So it's, it's not really not a big deal. We're very close. It's walking distance from the border, on both sides.
BRODIE: Is there a concern that with these new tariffs that fewer Mexicans will come into Douglas to shop in the stores in your town?
GRIJALVA: No, mainly because, when Mexico comes over here they just buy the American goods. So, you know, we call them changaritos, the little stores, you know, the mom and pop stores where they sell, you know, sort of grocery, a little bit of groceries and a little bit of other stuff, they'll come and buy our goods and then go, and then sell them over there for maybe even double the price, because they don't have an FDA over there.
So they really, they like our products, they like the American products and they buy them over here, take them back, and then make a profit out of them. So I mean, it benefits us because we keep the sales tax.
BRODIE: What are you seeing in terms of the ease with which people can cross the border and any of the, have you seen any impacts from, you know, from the Trump administration's focus on cracking down on border security and illegal immigration, things like that?
GRIJALVA: That's a great question. So I was sworn in December 11th, and then the next month, right a few hours before he was sworn in, I asked our legal, ‘Hey, you got to look at all those executive orders,’ just to see how they're going to affect us legally. They don't affect us legally, you know, it affects the cartels, it affects the illegal crossings. But then my biggest concern was the perception, especially with the media.
So we signed a declaration of emergency, basically we're not going against the federal government, but we're asking the Trump administration, hey, you know, if people stop crossing from Mexico to buy our goods, can you help us out with federal money? That's basically it.
We're kind of anticipating a drop, but actually just passing that declaration of emergency and then sending the president a letter. We've got no blowback. We actually have a great relationship with the federal government and a great relationship with Mexico because of it, because they took it well of us thinking about them and their citizens crossing.So, right now with that declaration we're in a good place with everybody, so we haven't seen a drop like other cities have.
BRODIE: So you've not seen fewer people, you know, on the streets of Douglas, you know, shopping in the stores in Douglas?
GRIJALVA: No, there, there's this sort of anxiety that it might happen, but I mean, people feel safe here. We're a town of 16,000. Agua Prieta's, I think, close to 150,000, so we really rely on them, but at the same time we all know each other here and we all know the people that cross. The only thing that separates us is the border. It's the same people, same culture. So Agua Prieta residents feel comfortable crossing here. So I think that's what's helped us out too, that we have a special relationship with them.
BRODIE: Did you actually hear back from the federal government after you sent that letter?
GRIJALVA: No, but I, I, but I kid around with people that I haven't came out on a tweet, so I think we're good.
BRODIE: Flying under the radar a little bit, I guess. So do you think that there's a chance that other people from other parts of Arizona might come to Douglas to do what Douglas residents are doing in terms of walking across the border, buying what they need and coming back? Like, do you think there might be an influx of people from other parts of Arizona coming to do that?
GRIJALVA: Yeah, and we hope so. I mean, because if it helps Agua Prieta and it helps out Douglas, it helps out the other cities. So we hope so. We've also been talking about at least, you know, spreading medical tourism because a lot of the services and the medical services in Mexico are cheaper, not really, vouching for them, but just saying, hey, they offer that over there.
So, you know, if they wanna come in and stay in Douglas and then, you know, buy Mexican products we're all for that, you know, we, we still keep the sales tax if they stay here overnight. We have a really safe community here. We respect our law enforcement, but you know, if they want to spend time in Mexico and, and go buy their products, all the better.
BRODIE: It sounds like these tariffs might provide somewhat of an opportunity, an economic opportunity for your town.
GRIJALVA: Yeah, and, and actually, because of sort of the uncertainty of, of both federal governments because, you know, when I met with Agua Prieta, it was four years that we really didn't have a relationship with them, a consistent one, so I, I had their their government officials come down here and I basically told them, listen. Yeah, Washington and Mexico City kind of forget about us.
We're like the, you know, they're fighting right now. We're kind of like the two children in between the fight, let's take care of each other, and I'm trying to really capitalize on that and capitalize on trade. We're gonna have a new port of entry that's going to be built. We're gonna be breaking ground in August for that, so we're going to need trade.
So I'm actually this month I'm going to be inviting a few Mexican cities like Hermosillo, Nacozari, Guaymas, and a few others to come and sign sister city agreements to push that trade so we can tell both federal governments, hey, we're working with each other, we're we're making this relationship work.
