Sen. Ruben Gallego says ACA subsidies are key to avoiding a government shutdown

The federal government is heading toward a shutdown next Wednesday if lawmakers can’t agree on a bill to pay to keep it open.

The federal fiscal year ends at midnight on Sept. 30, and while the House approved a temporary funding bill, known as a continuing resolution, or CR, the Senate needs 60 votes to OK it. That means seven Democrats would have to support it, and so far, that’s not happened.

Arizona’s junior senator, Democrat Ruben Gallego, joined The Show to talk about it.

Full conversation

BRODIE: What do you think the odds are of a deal coming together?

GALLEGO: Look, I think deal will come together eventually. You know, what we want is pretty simple. We want government to stay open, and we want to answer what people are really telling us that they're worried about, which is the cost of health care going up. We have premiums are going up everywhere across the country. They're going to start hitting in January. We can work in a bipartisan manner to fix this and finish this and move on.

BRODIE: Is the health care, the Affordable Care Act premium subsidies, is that sort of the main sticking point as far as you're concerned?

GALLEGO: For me, I can't speak for the rest of the caucus. For me, that is the main sticking point. That is like, you know, the "do not pass go, collect $200" without that. Because it is a direct tax we're just going to put on Americans right away. It does not have to happen. You know, we've been able to pass in bipartisan manner lots of budget bills in the past.

But if we are going to, you know, say that we're doing our best work, we're making Americans healthier — at a minimum, we need to make sure that these subsidies for Affordable Care Act happen. Or else you're going to see people's increases happen to be like $100 to $200 per month, right away starting in January.

BRODIE: So when you say that you think a deal will come together, do you think it will come together before Tuesday of next week?

GALLEGO: I have a hard time seeing that, because my colleagues on the House side when they voted for the bill, they then adjourned themselves past Oct. 1. ... And largely it's for a couple reasons. One, to put the Senate in a jam. But No. 2, they're also trying to avoid being in session as much as possible to avoid the Epstein files. And now that we have Arizona's first Latina congresswoman coming back, there's enough votes now to have a discharge petition for the Epstein files.

So, they're trying to run out the clock as much as possible, and unfortunately that's going to end up interfering with this budget negotiations.

BRODIE: What gives you confidence that there will be a deal, given that Republicans, as you referenced so far, have been unwilling to pass anything but what they're calling a "clean CR?" Just basically keeping the status quo, keep the government open, deal with all other policy issues later.

GALLEGO: Well, No. 1, this eventually starts affecting real people. And the threats that they're putting out there is we'll just start firing people without your permission. They've been doing that all year. So they've been shutting down government and starting up government in a very chaotic manner.

Right now, what we need to be focusing on is trying to figure out how to actually bring people the health care that they're demanding and need and have stopped this, like, huge increase in premiums that the government — the Republicans — are going to essentially impose by having no action. And this is the time and the place to do it.

BRODIE: Are you concerned about what the White House has said, though, in terms of — they're saying they're preparing for big-time layoffs and firings if the federal government shuts down. The executive branch, of course, has much more leeway to do kind of what it wants if the government is shut down. Does that concern you?

GALLEGO: It doesn't concern me, because they been doing that this whole year. I mean, they've actually ignored the Supreme Court when Supreme Court said you can't fire people. So that threat doesn't work anymore. They're not listening to our budget appropriations, and it's really wonky, everything else like that. But basically every time we say this is what you can spend money on, they're saying, "Yeah, we don't have to listen to that."

So that threat doesn't work. The real threat that matters to me is the fact that there's gonna be millions of Americans — thousands of Arizonans, tens of thousands of Arizonans — are gonna have their premiums increase, because the Republicans refuse to actually come to a compromise that's a fairly safe compromise that makes sure that Americans and their children are gonna have access to affordable health care.

And all we have to do is work in a bipartisan manner. And they're refusing to do that.

BRODIE: So, what do you think would change the calculation then for Republicans to get on board and try to go along with reinstating some of these premium subsidies?

GALLEGO: Well, look, I think at the end of the day, the American public does not like shutdowns. I've been through, I think probably four shutdowns my whole time that I've been in Congress. And I think at the end of the day, they want to see government working together. And that's how these budget deals end up coming together.

It's in a very compromised manner where Democrats and Republicans, they join. Not everyone gets what they want, but we end up keeping the government open, and we kept moving forward. What we're asking is not even to take away anything. What we're asking is to give people affordable health care, people that deserve it, Americans, U.S. citizens, that the Republicans are going to increase their premiums by Jan. 1. You know, essentially a tax of maybe $200 to $300 per family, here in Arizona and other parts of the country, because of their inaction. That's all we're asking for, is a good budget compromise.

BRODIE: Have you heard from any of your Republican colleagues, even behind the scenes, that that's something that they can get on board with?

GALLEGO: Not yet. But talking to my friends that I have good relationships with, they want to come to a compromise, too. The question is, this is just a three-part dance. You have ... Republicans of the House, Senate Republicans and then the president. And so they have to come into alignment.

I think for whatever reason, they don't see the danger right now with rising inflation, cost of health care going up, millions of people getting kicked off Medicaid, that also adding an extra 200, $300 per family premium per month is going to be significantly damaging to the personal incomes of families right now.

BRODIE: It kind of sounds, and please correct me if I'm wrong, that your perspective is at this point some kind of a shutdown — even if it's a short one — sounds like you're saying it's kind of inevitable at this point.

GALLEGO: Unfortunately, I think so. Because they're just not willing to talk and work in a compromised manner. Basically, the message that's been sent out is like: "It's our way or the highway." And that's never been the way that you actually get these budget compromises. And I think the closer we get to it, I hope they'll have another change of heart.

But it's not a change of heart about dealing with us, dealing with Democrats or anything of that nature. They should be thinking about the fact that, again, you have an opportunity to stop these huge taxes — unofficial taxes — premiums that Americans are going to be receiving starting January. Come work with us now because this is the worst time we could be raising, making Americans pay more for anything.

Costs are going through the roof for everything. And now the government is going to actively decide to bring more cost to tens of millions of Americans.

BRODIE: There's been a lot written about sort of the interesting position that especially Senate Democrats are in now. Because in the past, it's your party that's been arguing for the clean CRs. Let's just keep the government open. Let's not deal with policies. Is this sort of like cognitive dissonance for you to now be arguing against the position that for so long Democrats have argued for?

GALLEGO: Not really, because in the past, a clean CR actually was a clean CR. Or if we pass in a budget appropriation, they would actually listen to it.

BRODIE: The White House, the executive branch.

GALLEGO: The executive branch, right. And so anytime we've since have passed budgets and we have even passed CRs, this White House has absolutely just gone and just say, "Well, we don't have to do that." Or they've actually gone and say, "Well, give us a 60 votes." And then they'll take 51 votes and do what's called rescission cuts, right?

So they're not honoring anything. There is no real budget anymore. And so they're trying to hold us to an old norm that they don't listen to anymore. The norm that I care about is making sure that Americans have affordable health care and that we're not rising the everyday costs of Americans. And we have a couple months to do that before Americans start feeling the real hits of these premiums starting in January.

BRODIE: Very quickly, before we let you go, assuming that there is a shutdown, is there a way to try to ensure that it's reasonably short?

GALLEGO: I think that's entirely up to the way the White House decides to do this. Now, what we've seen so far, especially with the shutdowns with DOGE, with the people getting fired, it's usually very chaotic. It's never good. But the way to all avoid this is to work with us. Let's make sure Americans don't have $200, $300 extra they have to pay for a month for insurance.

Something that we've all worked together in the past. We're saving tens of millions of Americans thousands of dollars. And all we have to do is come to an agreement. We all agree that people shouldn't have to pay more for health care.

BRODIE: All right, we'll have to leave it there. Arizona Sen. Ruben Gallego. Sen. Gallego, thanks so much.

GALLEGO: Thank you for your time.