Rita Rudner is a comedy legend. How she became a reliable punchline machine

The word “legend” gets thrown around a lot in popular culture, but there aren’t many artists who fit the bill. Rita Rudner is on that list.

She’s practically synonymous with Las Vegas comedy — which makes her one of the defining figures of a particular style of American comedy. Her Vegas solo show ran for over a decade, selling over two million tickets. She’s done HBO specials, sold out Carnegie Hall, and written six books.

With a career spanning 50 years and counting, she’s still at it. And if the idea of a pioneering female comedian dominating Vegas and still evolving late in life reminds you of the HBO series “Hacks” — well, that’s because the character of Deborah Vance is partly based on Rudner.

Rudner will be at Scottsdale Center for the Performing Arts this weekend, and she spoke with The Show recently about the origins of her signature style, which is often described as “epigramatic” and “rapid-fire.”

She said her original plan was to be a dancer on Broadway — which she was, starting when she was a teenager. But after about 10 years in the theater, one day, back in the 1970’s, she was flipping through the New York Times, and she got an idea.

Full conversation

RITA RUDNER: I was reading an article about Softsoap, and it was when Softsoap first came on the market and it was a big hit. And they were interviewing the person who invented the campaign, and he said, well, we had a new idea for a soap, and we said, are we going to do another bar soap or are we going to invent a new commodity that doesn't exist, that we will have a lot more potential to succeed?

So I said, well, why don't I try to be Softsoap instead of things that are too crowded? I said, there's just a whole world out there that hasn't been explored for female comedians. So I'll try that.

SAM DINGMAN: Yeah. Yeah. Well, I have so many follow up questions for you about this, Rita.

RUDNER: I know we don't have time, so, no, no.

DINGMAN: Well, I'll just. I'll try to get to as many as I can.

RUDNER: Oh, you say whatever you want. I'm drinking, just so you'll know. I'm drinking an apple cider and Perrier in a glass that my daughter gave me for my birthday. It's very nice.

DINGMAN: Oh, OK. What does the glass look like?

RUDNER: It's like a red wine glass, but it has painted flowers and butterflies and pretty things on it. Because I like that.

DINGMAN: That's lovely. OK. So when you're trying to be an actor and maybe a dancer in particular, there's a way in which you're trying to be similar to other dancers and actors, right. Because there's a form to it. There's a style. And you want to be recognizable as someone who can be part of an ensemble.

But being a comedian, it strikes me, is entirely different, right. You're trying to stand out as having your own individual voice, somebody to go with your Softsoap example, who is unlike anyone else.

RUDNER: But if you're, if you're yourself, you're going to be unlike anyone else.

So I just said, I'm just going to be who I am. I was an overprotected Jewish girl from Miami. So one of my first jokes was, I wasn't the class clown. I was very boring. I was the class anesthesiologist. I remember, I remember that one.

DINGMAN: Yeah. Can I ask you, Rita, what do you remember about your early experiences of going on stage and doing those jokes?

RUDNER: Oh, it was horrifying. My first time, nobody laughed at any of the jokes I wrote, but they laughed between the jokes at me being uncomfortable. Very often a comedian has to have an aura where people want to laugh at you. I said, well, there's something there. Now I just have to get people to laugh at what I'm saying that works. Instead of people laughing that I'm saying things that don't work.

DINGMAN: So that's interesting. Am I hearing you right then, that what you did is you recognized that people were somehow reacting to this aura of you feeling uncomfortable and out of place, and then tried to write material that matched up with that aura?

RUDNER: I studied a lot of Woody Allen because he was a Jewish comedian that was uncomfortable. And then I studied Jack Benny. 'Cause he was my mother's favorite. And he didn't look like a comedian at all. And that's why he was funny.

DINGMAN: Interesting. And let me ask you about the style that you ended up with, because one of my favorite things about your work is that, if I may, you're like a punchline machine. It's just like joke to joke to joke.

And one of my favorites is this is from a while back. So forgive me, but you say all my friends are in therapy. One of them's in aromatherapy. She spends her time telling her problems to a scented candle.

RUDNER: Yeah, I'm glad you like that. That's one of my, you know what? They're all different kinds of jokes. And I try to vary from a punchline to an abstract. And now I do many more. I've introduced stories in my act, which were always a challenge for me. I always admire comedians who had so much self-confidence they could go for like a minute or two without a laugh, you know, and just talk.

And I said, well, I just don't know if I can do that because I rely on people's laughter. And you know, I know I do on the average of three jokes a minute because I had to time it out when I did television, and I had five minutes to do a set on Carson or Letterman and I'd say, oh, let's see how.

And I time myself and I'd leave him enough for enough laughter. And so I always time myself. But now I'm a bit more relaxed, I'm a bit more. Because I've done it so long, I feel like I can afford to be a presence that doesn't have to have a laugh every 30 seconds.

DINGMAN: Yes, well, you know, it's gotten so much more common in standup for comics to be very personal, sort of conversational with the audience.

And yet one of my favorite things about that bit that you're doing about the aromatherapy, that's part of a larger bit about aging for women in particular. And you know, you're going from joke to joke to joke. But there's one point where you say to the audience something like, well, it doesn't get any easier as we get older, does it, ladies?

And then you hear the whole room like, shout back at you like, "No, it doesn't."

So clearly they're hanging on your every word. There is a relationship there, even if you're not necessarily doing conversational, intimate material.

RUDNER: I like to always choose a premise that is universal. Computers, AI. I had a fight with my AI personal assistant in a rented car in Florida.

DINGMAN: No, what were you arguing about?

RUDNER: Well, she kept calling me Leonard anyway, so, see what I mean? See, there's lots of things you can talk about that are bothering me today. When a toilet is smarter than I am, it's upsetting.

DINGMAN: Well, I, I would love to ask you just one more question, Rita, if you don't mind.

RUDNER: Sure, anything you need, Mr. Sam.

DINGMAN: The co-creator, Paul W. Downs, of the HBO series "Hacks" has said that the character of Deborah Vance is partly based on you. And I'm wondering if you have watched the show and if you have, if you think it's a good portrayal of a journey like your own. I know it's not the same person, obviously.

RUDNER: Well, here's my problem and here's why I haven't watched it. And maybe I'm being a little bit too precious. You tell me, Sam. OK, I hate the title because it is so disparaging to me, to be called a hack is insulting.

DINGMAN: Sure.

RUDNER: Like, it's like if you did a show about doctors and said, let's call it "Butchers."

DINGMAN: I appreciate that answer very much, especially because as we've been talking, it's very clear to me how carefully you have thought about your work as a craft.

RUDNER: Yeah. It's really like, I go in like a surgeon and I say, I'm really gonna try to make this work. And when I try a new joke, I really try hard to put it between two old jokes so I don't let the audience down for, like, a half a second. I mean, it's my job, and I take it seriously.

DINGMAN: All right, well, I have been speaking with the legendary comedian Rita Rudner. Rita will be at the Virginia G. Piper Theater at the Scottsdale Center for the Arts on Dec. 13 at 7:30 p.m. Rita, thank you for this conversation.

RUDNER: Thank you, Mr. Sam. And you have a wonderful day. I'm gonna have more of my apple cider and Perrier.