The Justice Department is investigating ASU over DEI. What we can learn from other universities

MARK BRODIE: The U.S. Justice Department has launched an investigation into Arizona State University. The feds say they’re looking into diversity, equity and inclusion, or DEI, practices at the university.

The investigation comes after secretly-recorded videos went public. ASU has denied it’s doing anything illegal.

With me now to talk more about this is Jasper Smith, staff reporter at the Chronicle of Higher Education.

Education

Trump administration opens DEI investigation into Arizona State University

Wayne Schutsky

The U.S. Department of Justice is investigating claims that Arizona State University is illegally discriminating against some students by operating surreptitious diversity, equity and inclusion programs.

MARK BRODIE: Jasper, good morning.

JASPER SMITH: Good morning. Thanks so much for having me.

MARK BRODIE: Thanks for being here. So, let's talk first off about these videos. Who — what is the group that made them and what did they show?

JASPER SMITH: So, the group that made them is Accuracy in Media, and they're a conservative group, and they go around colleges and universities and they have someone pose as like a prospective student, and they ask staff and administrators about their DEI offerings.

And so, in many of these videos, they often go viral, and they're successful in getting these employees to discuss about the ways that they might still be doing diversity-focused work, often in states where such efforts are banned or have been heavily restricted.

And so, in this video or in these series of videos that we see at ASU, we have, you know, these administrators or employees talking about the ways that diversity or inclusion might still show up in curriculum. Like, for example, you know, in one of the videos we see a woman who is said to be the associate director of the School of Criminology and Social Justice. She's talking about how there's still some focus on marginalized communities and discrimination or gender in their criminal justice course offerings.

And so, this is then clipped and put into these videos, and it's kind of a gotcha moment for these ASU employees. And so, that's what we see in these viral videos.

MARK BRODIE: Well, and ASU has said that, among the other things they've said, first they've said this is like — we're not doing what we're being accused of doing, but also that the people in the videos are not authorized to speak on behalf of the university, right?

JASPER SMITH: Yeah, that's correct.

MARK BRODIE: So, what is the Justice Department saying that ASU is doing that it shouldn't be doing based on what these folks in these videos had to say?

SMITH: So, the Justice Department is saying that these videos indicate that ASU is discriminating against students based on race, color, national origin, while trying to hide its practices from the government. And so, I think what's important for people to know is just kind of like where the Justice Department is kind of coming from over the past year when it comes to diversity, equity, inclusion initiatives.

And so, July of last year, we saw the Justice Department put out this long list of campus activities that they feel are now discriminatory. So, things like race-conscious centers, diversity centers, you know, hiring practices that suggest, you know, certain identity practices, or any program with the explicit goal of increasing diversity. And so, now you have, you know, a viral video of university employees talking about the ways that ... at one point, one woman says that: "We are DEI."

So, it kind of comes at odds of what the Justice Department is deeming as discriminatory. But more importantly, that they are accusing the university of hiding these efforts from the government. And so, that's what's getting ASU in hot water right now with the Justice Department, specifically the Civil Rights Division.

MARK BRODIE: Do we have any sense of what this investigation might look like, or how long it might take, or what might come out of it in terms of if, for example, the Justice Department finds that ASU is still incorporating DEI, what the penalty might be?

JASPER SMITH: Yeah, so the Justice Department has not reached any conclusions about the investigation yet. But what we do know is that if the Justice Department finds that the university is engaged in discriminatory or illegal practices, it can seek to pull federal funding.

And so, what we can kind of I guess — we could look to see how the Justice Department has investigated other universities, specifically with the way that they have offered diversity initiatives or even spoke about diversity initiatives. Over the last year, I've done a lot of coverage at George Mason University in Virginia that also was, you know, subject of several federal investigations from both the Justice Department and the Department of Education over their diversity initiatives. And so, that's been a back-and-forth for months between ... [the] university president and the government.

And so, we don't know what the timeline will be for ASU. But we do know that if they are found, you know, in violation of federal law, we can see some back-and-forth, some negotiations, and possibly the, you know, rescission of federal funding. That isn't always likely. More likely than not, it's probably going to come to some sort of resolution agreement, which is essentially like the university promising to get rid of these initiatives and prove that they will no longer discriminate against students.

MARK BRODIE: I was going to ask, Jasper, if there are other schools that that either are or have gone through this. It sounds like at least one, George Mason, has gone through something similar. Are there other schools that have been subject to DOJ investigations specifically related to DEI also?

JAPSER SMITH: Oh, well the main one that comes to mind is definitely George Mason University when it comes specifically to diversity initiatives. And, you know, we've seen the Justice Department go after some schools of California as well. But when we look at the diversity offerings in particular, George Mason definitely comes to mind, just because of the intensity of the investigations and also what the Justice Department was asking the university to do.

You know, they had accused the president of openly advocating for race- and sex-based hiring of faculty. And they wanted him to apologize. And, you know, that apology could open him up to legal issues, and so he refused to do that. And so, they're still negotiating what that resolution agreement could look like and, you know, what I guess the end of that investigation could look like.

And so, I think, you know, looking to George Mason could give us some clues about how this might go. But I think it's also important to note that this isn't the first time, you know, ASU has kind of come under fire from the government because of diversity offerings. If you remember, you know, last year, the Ph.D. Project, their participation with the Ph.D. Project, which is an organization focused on getting students of color through business business doctoral programs, they had to remove their ties with that organization after an investigation was launched.

And so, yeah, those are definitely the things that come to mind with how the government has been going after colleges and universities for the ways that they are, you know, looking to implement DEI on their campuses.

MARK BRODIE: Sure. Well, certainly lots more to come on this investigation with ASU. That is Jasper Smith, staff reporter with the Chronicle of Higher Education. Jasper, thanks so much. Appreciate it.

JAPER SMITH: Thank you.